A week after Republicans suffered bruising midterm losses, Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth and Secretary of State Marco Rubio appeared to be reaching for the same defense of their roles in carrying out unpopular Trump administration policies: “I was just following orders.” And experts say this defense could be more revealing ― and complicated ― than most people realize.
Earlier this week, Hegseth, who narrowly avoided a Republican-led impeachment on Wednesday, defended his actions, doubling down on his insistence that U.S. military operations under his watch have been lawful.
The articles filed by outgoing Rep. Thomas Massie (R-Ky.) accused Hegseth of unlawfully waging war in Iran and Yemen, capturing former Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro and striking suspected drug trafficking boats.
“What one disgruntled and defeated congressman is attempting is not oversight, and it’s not accountability,” Hegseth said at the top of his speech without naming Massie specifically. “It’s a political spectacle, a personal manifesto driven by ego and resentment.”
But midway through his statement, Hegseth implied he was just following President Donald Trump’s orders to defend his wartime actions.
“As for the articles themselves, Iran, the cartels, Maduro, Yemen, every one was a lawful operation ordered by the commander in chief, then ordered by myself, notified to Congress and executed by American warriors who did their jobs,” the Pentagon chief said.
The statement prompted debate over the constitutional responsibilities of Cabinet members.
Journalist Aaron Rupar boiled down Hegseth’s comments to “he was just following orders, you see” in a post on X — resulting in a barrage of mockery. Some critics compared the the remarks to the so-called “superior orders” defense, also known as the Nuremberg defense, in which Nazi defendants argued they were simply following orders.
Not long after, Rubio said something strikingly similar while discussing the war in Iran with reporters in Paris, where he’s attending the G7 Foreign Ministers Meeting.
“Ultimately our job is to execute on the president’s orders,” Rubio said.
“The president takes a lot of input from people in his administration,” the secretary continued. “He takes input and ideas from our partners and our allies around the world, to outside experts, to the people he talks to. But in the end, the decision is the president. And once the president chooses a direction, it’s our job in this administration to execute on the president’s direction.”
Experts we spoke to said both men seem to be trying to absolve themselves of the administration’s actions, while still trying to maintain power and order.
“The only somewhat similar case I can think of is the Saturday Night Massacre, when Solicitor General Robert Bork carried out President Richard Nixon’s order to fire Watergate special prosecutor Archibald Cox,” said Jacob Neiheisel, an associate professor of political science at the University at Buffalo, SUNY. (Bork defended his decision by arguing he was simply following a direct order from the president.)
Rubio has more reason to want to distance himself from Trump’s more unpopular policies, Neiheisel said. While he’s recently denied reports he is considering leaving his post ahead of a presidential run, he’s currently a top potential contender for the 2028 Republican presidential nomination, alongside Vice President JD Vance.
“Rubio and Hegseth have very little realistic chance of decoupling themselves from Trump at this point, though,” Neiheisel said.
HuffPost has reached out to the Pentagon and the Office of the Secretary of State, but did not immediately hear back at the time of publication.
While Hegseth was granted a reprieve this week, it’s entirely possible the Democrats could resuscitate the effort in January, when they take control of both the House and Senate following their victories in the midterms.
Looking at it from a psychological standpoint, licensed professional clinical counselor Sandra Maurer said Rubio and Hegseth’s quick reaction to disown their decisions is very likely that this is due to the unexpected message in the midterms.
“That signaled the end of Trump-loyalty as a ticket to power,” she said. “They’re clearly hoping that as Trump sinks, they can pile a bunch of their own horrific decisions onto his ship with him.”
Maurer said she’s not surprised by the men’s actions, though.
“People with track records of avoiding accountability and performing their government roles as if they were on a reality TV show are unlikely to take accountability for any behavior, regardless of whether they can pass the buck to Trump or not,” she said.
Kari J. Winter, a professor of American studies at the University at Buffalo, said she thinks Hegseth is trying to curry favor with Trump, whom he likely sees as someone who can protect him, and the “I was just following orders” claim is likely a futile defense.
“It didn’t work out well for the Nazis prosecuted at Nuremberg, and it’s an even less plausible attempt at self-exoneration in a democracy whose military is constitutionally authorized to refuse to follow illegal orders.”
Not everyone agrees with critics who say the secretaries are invoking an “I don’t make the rules, I just enforce them” defense of their actions.
In his statement, Hegseth defended the actions on their merits, rather than simply pointing to the fact that they were ordered by the president, said Grant Reeher, a political science professor at Syracuse University’s Maxwell School. Rubio, meanwhile, defended Trump’s Iran policy and highlighted what he described as a successful economic campaign against the country.
To him, Rubio was simply describing how the executive branch works, Reeher said. “The president does give orders, especially in the international sphere,” he told HuffPost.
When the stakes are high, whether because of declining public support or uncertainty about what comes next, the instinct toward self-preservation can become especially strong, said Jennifer Chappell Marsh, a therapist in San Diego, California.
“From psychological standpoint, it’s not all that surprising to see people start distancing themselves from decisions that are now coming under scrutiny,” she said.
Still, Rubio may find it difficult to distance himself from the Trump administration’s second-term policies, particularly those he helped shape and carry out. If he has presidential ambitions, he’ll have to reckon with his record as the nation’s top diplomat and a central figure in executing Trump’s foreign policy, including the deeply controversial and unpopular war in Iran.
“Something I talk about a lot as a therapist is that there’s a big difference between explaining why you did something and actually taking responsibility for it,” Chappell Marsh said.
“It’s one thing to say, ‘Well, I was just doing what I was told.’ It’s another thing to say, ‘I made the choice to go along with it, and I have to own that,’” she said. “Being accountable for your part is where emotional maturity really shows up in a politician.”